GLMF board down

[Kelzar]

Panda said:

Take one suggestion....better parking people.....yes we have a system in place, do you guys need to worry about it...no.

This is precisely the type of reaction that makes many of us feel as though we are unheard. Unless you plan on driving to my house, picking me up, dropping me off at the front gate, walking astride me all day long so that you can drive me back to my house the minute I wish to leave, then yes I believe I have a reason to worry about what this "system" is. If you were to offer information or ask for suggestions, we would be much more convinced that our voices have registered on the membrane of your eardrums.

Also a quick side note, your Fredrick Douglass sign off exhudes an extremely arrogant position. Not to be snippy, really, it just comes across badly in text.

[Hephzibah]

Hear Hear Kelzar.

I must say Panda that it does sound as if you are speaking down to us.

[Sir Trevor]

Am I the only one that actually apreciates the fact that someone from staff actually cares enough to look over here and post openly?

Don't kill the messenger people.

While she is staff, I don't think any problems you have are with her. I think they rest higher up.

As to the sig
C'mon.
I am sure anyone who has worked in the service industry has similar feelings. You should see some of the sig lines I have used in my time on the net.
I won't use them her because, well, I'm in charge and have to behave somewhat, but on boards where I am just a member, (like panda is here) you wouldn't recognize me

[Panda]

I don't mean to sound like i'm speaking down to you. I just care as much as you guys do. But i happen to be on the other side of the fence. Faire is my home too. Literally, for like 4 monthes out of the year. And anything that can be done to make it better should at least be looked at, wheather it's possible or not.

It's just very hard to listen to all the complaints over and over again, knowing that we can't fix alot of it until spring when the rest of the staff returns. And until then we can't give you definite answers on alot of things. Alot of what we do in the off season is troubleshoot. We sit in 12 hour meetings discussing everything and anything that gets brought up. Including what our patrons concerns are.

I just don't understand why that's not enough for some of you.

[Hephzibah]

NO Trevor you are not the only one but I do not like feeling as if I am being talked down to. Yes I understand about the contracts and such but when explaining it to the rest of us use words that do not inflame others even further and for the other thing that is her right to sig as she wants Iwasn't refering to that

[Kelzar]

The comment on the sig was in coorelation with the attitude that seems to harbor arrogance. Take a look at my sig, pretty damned sarcastic. However not the sig I would use (especially at first) if I were addressing people attending a refresher driving course.

In regards to killing the messenger, if that is how I come across, my apologies. I am quite glad that her presence is here, it does show an interest in hearing what many of us are talking about.
How she responds to comments, flames and suggestions will also show if it is in earnest interest, morbid curiousity, or fly-on-the-wall intent.

[Capt. Morgan]

I think the observation I have made is…having come to this Faire from day 1 (when it was right next to the Lake!)…The Faire seem to be “re-inventing the wheel” every year due to a lack of consistency in procedure. Now, I understand turn around in a job, especially a job that has a limited time frame…as you pointed out, 4 months for you….but there is some standards and quality of service that is sacrificed when you don’t have the same people doing the same job year after year…and none of us expect that you will have that luxury…but a SOP (Standard Operating Procedure) in place would probably allieviate many of the problems you face year after year.

Take parking for example…I remember the guy (Steve) who used to run it. Now…things change, people come and go…but Steve and his crew had parking “down cold”. He knew how to park people and how to instruct his assistants to park people. Steve leaves…BOOM…you get someone else in. Maybe they don’t know how it was run before, so they start their own way to park. The result? Those of us who get up early to get to Faire so we can park closer are now directed out to the “back 40” near Loch Ness (the pond). As weekly attendees, we don’t get up early to be stuck out in the boonies…so, by the “trickle down effect” who you choose to handle what does affect us.

Take Tickets. As I have pointed out my example of what many of us went through last year. Is there an SOP on handling ticketing? Handling files and record keeping? Is it consistent from one year to the next or is everybody just “winging it” when they get hired because no one has developed an SOP? These are just observations I have made from year to year.

Establish a set way to handle certain tasks and then, no matter who is doing it from year to year, there will be consistency and uniformity. You won’t be scurrying around trying to figure out what to do or “re-inventing the wheel” as it appears you are doing each time the Faire rolls around.

[Capt. Morgan]

Panda said:

As one of TPTB WE DO LISTEN!!!!

...And no you don't have to be a member to read, and you can log on as a guest if you want to post. No gates there.

The message we all got from GLMF was the following:

The GLMF message boards are being permanantly removed. A cast only section will remain for information on rehearsals and the like.

GLMF

Regards,

The Great Lakes Medieval Faire Message Board team

www.medievalfaire.com/cgi/yabb/YaBB.cgi


So...what you are saying is that we can post on the Board if we register? That would seem to indicate that the GLMF message boards haven't been permanantly removed...just cleaned up yet the message states clearly: A cast only section...

Now I'm confused...(and no, it doesn't take much...)

[Brook]

Jasmine said:

On first hearing about the demise of the official boards, I was shocked. But upon reflection, I realized it was inevitable. What Brook cannot control, he gets rid of. This is not complaint or being negative, just simple fact. Had little or nothing to do with being "good for the faire", except in his head.

I will be civil, but I will speak the truth as I see it. I cannot and will not be "nice". Too many people I care about, not to mention myself, have been hurt by the tptb. It was not the board that was the "rabid dog".

I would like to say that I am very tired of constantly being attacked by a few select people. Up until now, I have felt it more professional to let people have their say and not respond to the bait. It is obviously easier to blame me for any percieved wrongs because I am in a position that can be changed. Larry is immune to this sort of thing because he is the owner and nothing can change that. But I would like to make it clear that the desisions made by the entertainment department are ALWAYS done so only after they are discussed with and approved by Larry. I do not set the budget, when Larry says "Cut the budget, cut some acts" I do as I am told. He is the boss. I have absolutly nothing to do with parking, food workers and the like.

As far as the message boards go, here is the history. This past season when the boards exploded on the currency issue, Larry said take them down. "Take them down now, they are hurting the faire" I stood up and fought for the boards to remain and they did. I argued that there was much more good that came from the boards than bad. And for the most part everyone posting proved me right. Untill this last month when the boards exploded again. This time there was no discussion, no pleading to be done. Larry simply said "that was that, remove them, I am done with it". At least this time I have been able to salvage a board for the cast and important info they need throughout rehearsals.

Think about it this way. The GLMF site and the boards are meant to be a marketing tool for the faire. While the boards created a place for all to chat and give input, it also gave them a place to gripe. Now imagine that you are a complete stranger to the faire, you log onto the boards to see what it is about and find all the negativity that was there. Are you going to choose to visit our faire or not? Probably not. As a buisness we need to present ourselves in the best possible light. To do otherwise would be bad buisness practice.

Complaints and sugestions will always be welcomed by the faire, but that information should be handled in private. You certainly don't see Disney airing all thier dirty laundry for all to see.

Larry is doing what he feels is in the best interest of the faire. Please stop attacking the messenger. It is hurtfull and rude. No matter if I agree with his decisions or not, Larry is my employer, he allows me to pay my bills and support my amazing wife and daughter, I must do as I am instructed. I certainly don't mean this to be a cop out. Have I made bad choices? Yes, but haven't we all? Will I make more? Probably, I am human. Life is about learning from mistakes and growing. Is everything I am accused of true? No. Much can be said when feelings are hurt and tempers are high. Even things that seem quite appearent aren't always as they seem.

Take the incident at final pub sing: You saw me get upset and leave the stage angry. I am sure it looked bad and I looked like an ass. What really happened is this: I was not informed that sword school planned a bit. I was surprised and literally manhandled onto the stage. Once on the stage the two began a cat fight over me. Very funny to the audience, but I was in the middle and was being hurt. Not my ego, I mean physically hurt. I had bruising on my arms and side for nearly a week. My reaction was more preservation instinct than anything else. I broke free, snapped at people and left the stage. Was I mad? No, I was scared. We have rules within the cast to prevent that sort of thing from happening, they simply didn't know the rules. Was there ever any talk of not bringing them back because of a foolish misunderstanding? No! Sword school and I discussed the issue the next day and it was put to bed.

There are always many sides to every story. But, the bottom line is this:

I love this faire as much as any of you, and I will always strive to make it better. I do not blame anyone for attacking me, I know it comes from your great love of the faire as well. Although I cannot always answer officially, I will always be happy to answer personally.

Unofficially, but most sincerely,
Brook

[Sir Trevor]

Thank you Brook for your candor.

I will say, if I owned the faire, I too would have taken the board down. It was not serving the faires interest and was more a liability than anything else.
Sorry guys, just being realistic here.
A lot of the behavior going on there, would not have been tolerated on any other 'official' board I have ever been a member of.

Sure some of it could have been avoided, but that is a whole different kettle of fish.

That said, I'll still let you guys rant and rave and voice your opinions, but please try to keep personal bashing out of it.
You can still talk about how mad it makes you, how POed you are about the situation, but please try to do it without taking personal pot-shots at people.
Everyone is welcome here. And everyone here deserves some courtesy.
I like you all, and love to hear what you think, but I do want to try to make this place fun, and not just a place to bash the faire.

[Kelzar]

Thank you for the well constructed letter. Here are a few points I'd like to discuss to hopefully turn a monologue into some open conversation.

Guest-Brook said:

Up until now, I have felt it more professional to let people have their say and not respond to the bait.

A person of position really ought not to feel baited in order to offer pertinent information.

Guest-Brook said:

It is obviously easier to blame me for any percieved wrongs because I am in a position that can be changed.

Easier to blame you than to what? Storm the bastille? The responsibility of improving GLMF rests on your shoulders. Doing the best you can with the budget you are given is one reason why this position exists. Providing the customers with the acts they want to see without their feedback is difficult. We are trying to provide that feedback.

Guest-Brook said:

Larry is immune to this sort of thing because he is the owner and nothing can change that.

Ummm, no. Neither is he immune and if GLMF were to run for a fiscal loss without signs of recovery how long before he'd rather not be the owner?

Guest-Brook said:

I have absolutly nothing to do with parking, food workers and the like.

Very well, we posted our complaints and suggestions for WHOMEVER does have jurisdiction in these areas.

Guest-Brook said:

Complaints and sugestions will always be welcomed by the faire, but that information should be handled in private. You certainly don't see Disney airing all thier dirty laundry for all to see.

I disagree, I think many of the complaints/suggestions could be added in the FAQ area. If Disney had a disasterous parking scenario like the mud pit that mother nature delivered here, I would expect that part of their advertising would be about the improvements they've made to the parking conditions and drainage.

Overall I suspect in the minds of many the unofficial "official" explaination as to why the boards disintegrated will be......"Because Larry said so"

I'm sure as a facilitator your hands are tied on some topics, responding to our concerns with silence or a "Don't worry about it we know what we are doing" type of response does not host feelings that we all are on board with the cause of improving GLMF.

[Kayenne]

First I want say, while I did not intend to offend people, I will not apologize for what I said. I stand by every word. With all due respect, anyone expecting an apology will be waiting quite a while.

Secondly, I want to thank Kelzar for saying the things I would've said, only he said them better.

Thirdly, I am not saying no one at the top cares, I am sure most people on staff do care, and work very hard to make the faire a better place. But there are still very serious problems, and a general attitude of "we know better" which is patently unhelpful and serves only to alienate patrons, performers, vendors. These issues are public now and will not go away. Until they are addressed there will be little improvement.

Fourthly, as regards the "late great" official GLMF board. What I mean by "gated" is having to register to just to read. No, you don't have to pay, but it still a hassle when you just want to look. Most boards let you read them without registering, which means they are more open to the public.
And if there was a legitimate concern about "bad PR" on the boards, there were less drastic ways to deal with it. You could eliminate the "offending" threads and warn the "offending" posters (or eliminate them, too). These measures seem draconian, but are certainly better than getting rid of the whole board. There were many threads (and many innocent posters) which had nothing to do with controversial issues. But the board was completely eliminated, which indicates to me it was a personal reason, not professional.

[Kayenne]

As for Disney "airing dirty laundry", they have had quite a bit of that, actually. There was a fuss some years back about their policy concerning facial hair on male employees. And more recently, there was the very public coup against Michael Eisner by some of his own board members. I'm sure Eisner and company wouldn't have wanted any of that public.

But sometimes you have to bring issues out into the open, because that is the only way they can be dealt with.

[Griffin]

I'm glad to find everyone in rousing spirits in this realm. I am reminded of how much I am looking forward to being with you all again.
It is exciting to see people discussing things openly here. As a vendor, I probably can claim ignorance of many of our wonderful, talented peoples problems. I am happy that you are all with us at faire. You are at the heart of our spirit.
As a vendor I have but two concerns. First is to give my best presentation to the guests who come and visit us each year. GLMF is my life for about 2 months of each year. Second is you. Everyone there is important to me. Don't get me wrong, I know that changes are needed. I just hope to be able to be a part of a solution. I also have an understanding of business since I have been in business for all of my lifetimes. The reason for shutting down the board seems logical to me as long as it has any chance of effecting our presentation to the public. We need all the postive direction we can build. If problems exist. We should work together to develop agreements that will work for all. Idealism? Perhaps. Just my way.
Do I have anything to lose if GLMF fails? Financially, yes. Emotionally, yes. Spirtually, yes. Do I have anything to gain if we succeed? Most definitely.
Mostly I would miss you all.
Glad you are all here.

Master Griffin.

[Lady Catharine]

Jeez, this is a ruff crowd.....

JUST KIDDING OKAY>>?